Today I’m talking with Matt Hild, author of the new Olivia Newton-John biography “A Little More Love: The Life And Legacy Of Olivia Newton-John.”
kk / Forgotten Hits: Hi Matt – great to talk to you again. Congratulations on the publication of your second book. (We covered Matt’s first book, “Arrow Through The Heart: The Biography Of Andy Gibb,” via an interview done by long-time Forgotten Hits Reader Scott Paton …
https://forgottenhits60s.blogspot.com/2023/03/remembering-andy-gibb-on-what-would.html)
MATT HILD: Hi Kent. Well actually it’s more like my sixth book, but the others are mostly history books of an academic nature. But this is my second pop star bio — both of them on English-born, largely Australian-raised performers.
kk: I have to ask you – Olivia Newton-John and Andy Gibb had several career crossovers during their most popular chart years … tv appearances, a hit single and also an Australian connection. Were you inspired to tell Olivia’s story next after wrapping up your Andy Gibb project?
MH: There was a connection there, for sure. Olivia and Andy worked together a lot from 1978 to 1982, on TV, some concert performances, and two duets that they recorded in 1979, and they were close. I mention in this book how Andy was showing up for openings of Olivia’s and Pat Farrar’s Koala Blue stores as late as not even a whole year before he died. I had actually gotten to do a brief email interview with Olivia in May, 2021, for the book on Andy, and a number of people who I interviewed for that book (including Scott Paton) had crossed paths with Olivia back in those days or even worked with her to some degree, so in some ways writing a book about her seemed like a natural follow-up to the book on Andy.
kk: I have been a big fan of Olivia’s since the very start and this book brings back all kinds of memories of the backlash she had to deal with early on in her career when she kept winning Country Music Awards, including a Best Country Female Vocalist award and even a Best New Country Artist Award. A good percentage of the diehard Nashville folks were more than a little bit perturbed when a girl from Australia was cleaning up on their turf! (Of course, all of this was before her reinvention after the Sandy / ”Grease” period and the sexier videos like “Physical” by which point she’d left most of her country crooning behind.)
MH: It all seems a bit silly now, but at that time Nashville wasn’t too accepting of outsiders or of pop stars, except, of course, for Elvis Presley. As I mention in the book, John Denver (a friend of Olivia’s) faced some of that backlash, too, as someone who wasn’t from the American South and wasn’t part of the Nashville scene. He and Olivia both helped pave the way, I think, for more crossover success between the country and pop fields. But yeah, Olivia got a frosty reception in Nashville at first, but when she went back there in the late 1990s to record some of Back with a Heart and make some personal appearances, she was treated like royalty.
kk: Your book reminded me of a particularly awkward scene on the televised CMA Awards in 1975 when Charlie Rich (himself a former rocker, turned country artist), announced John Denver’s name as the winner of the Country Entertainer Of The Year Award and then let the paper on fire, on stage, that bore his name. (Charlie’s son later said that his dad was very drunk on stage that night.)
MH: Regardless of what Charlie Rich's intentions were that night, John Denver faced some of the same resentment from the country music establishment at that time that Olivia did. Yet, as I mention in the book, Olivia was Charlie's opening act at the Las Vegas Hilton in the summer of 1974, and he gave her a nice gift when their two-week engagement there ended.
kk: As you said in your book, two of the hottest Female Country Acts at the time were Olivia Newton-John from Australia and Anne Murray from Canada!
MH: And about 20-25 years later, Shania Twain, also a Canadian, would be one of the hottest. I think Olivia, in particular, helped pave the way for the later crossover success of Shania and Faith Hill, both of whom were big Olivia fans themselves. Shania faced some backlash, but not to the degree Olivia had.
kk: They both seemed to dominate the country music scene there in the early-to-mid ‘70’s.
MH: And yet, as you mentioned, in the late ‘70s Olivia reinvented herself … ”You’re the One that I Want,” “A Little More Love,” “Deeper than the Night” … she became a rock singer and sold even more records during the 1978-82 period than she had during her country period.
kk: Another point the book makes is that Olivia was judged as being almost TOO beautiful to be taken seriously as a recording artist. In what ways do you think this stereotype may have hindered her career early on?
MH: Even her record label (Uni, then MCA Records after that label absorbed Uni, Decca, etc.) was writing ads like “she sings songs that are as pretty as she is,” and before “Let Me Be There” became her first really big US hit, people at MCA were calling her “plastic.” But once she started racking up the million sellers, beginning with “Let Me Be There,” then I don’t think her beauty was hurting her career at all. Maybe it made some critics less inclined to like her, but as she told Rolling Stone, she cared more about whether the public liked her records than whether critics did. And her long run of big hits made it quite clear that the public loved her records.
kk: One thing that I REALLY like about your style of writing is that you’ve clearly done EXTENSIVE research in order to find all these quotes by and about Olivia from back at that time … which you then weigh against current observations and “look backs” with the benefit of so much hindsight … it really paints a much more complete picture of just how she was regarded over the course of her career.
MH: And some of those 1970s concert reviews really emphasize her beauty, too, and some of the reviews of her hit albums weren’t too kind. But when she returned to touring in the late 1990s, overall the tone of the concert reviews and newspaper and magazine articles took on a different tone, more appreciative of her talent and accomplishments, sometimes even almost reverential.
kk: Olivia certainly faced her health battles … and some financial woes as well … but overall she did SO much good for society with her cancer treatment centers. It’s so ironic to think that she herself would become a patient at one of her own clinics in later years.
MH: It speaks volumes about her unfailing positivity that she was inspired by her own first battle with cancer to help build that Olivia Newton-John Cancer & Wellness Centre in Australia, which she told someone would be her biggest legacy. And, yes, it was ironic that she later was a patient there, but I don’t think she ever really felt sorry for herself.
kk: She also had more than her fair share of “unlucky at love” moments over the years. In fact, there were times during the course of reading your book that I found myself wanting to ask you: Do you think she was ever TRULY happy? Certainly, she had fame and riches … and adoring fans all over the world … but in her REAL world, her personal world, there always seemed to be something lurking around the corner to knock things a bit off course. I couldn’t help but wonder if she ever had the chance to truly enjoy her success. What do you think? Did you get that same sort of vibe?
MH: Her greatest happiness in life came when her daughter was born in 1986. Her daughter became her pride and joy. Her last words, spoken to her daughter, were “my sunshine.” And her second marriage, to John Easterling, by all accounts was truly a very happy one. As for her heyday, I think she absolutely took pride in her success and accomplishments, but she also worked very hard and made a lot of sacrifices to achieve and sustain that success. And as the book explains, she certainly did have to deal with some of the drawbacks of fame, including some really obsessed, and in some cases, dangerous, fans.
kk: I assume you also followed her career as it was unfolding … what was your reaction at the time to Olivia’s complete make-over in the role of Sandy in the film “Grease?” Personally, I never saw it coming … but I think she pulled it off TREMENDOUSLY … and actually reinvented herself in the process for an entirely new career in the late ‘70’s and early ‘80s! It was just one more testament to the scope of her true talent.
MH: That’s another irony: she was reluctant to take that role, and as I relate in the book, via a story told to me by Steve Binder, when she watched the film, before it came out, she was terrified that it would be a bomb! But Grease really transformed her career. Her star had been slipping for about two years before that. Her records hadn’t been selling as well, and Rolling Stone was on the verge of cancelling a profile on her which Ben Fong-Torres had been interviewing her for on and off since 1975. Rolling Stone quickly changed its mind and published the piece on her when Grease came out!
kk: I was very fortunate to have seen Olivia perform live in concert a couple of times, including her final tour of America, which was simply amazing. With her health being what it was by this time, I honestly don’t know how she was able to pull it off, knowing the demands of a show of this stature, the travel, etc. I had heard that her body just completely gave out after some of these shows the minute she hit the dressing room.
MH: She was a true professional, and she cared a lot about pleasing her fans. That might sound trite, but there’s no doubt that it was true. Some of the people I talked to who worked with her or spent time with her before and after her shows in those last years were in tears as they were describing what Olivia was going through when she was doing those final tours or Las Vegas engagements.
kk: Again, this to me is just further testament to how much her fans meant to her … and her wanting to give them one last chance to see her up on stage.
(You can find our ONJ Concert Review here: https://forgottenhits60s.blogspot.com/2022/08/olivia-newton-john.html)
MH: Exactly. She didn’t need the money. In her heyday, she didn’t particularly enjoy tours and concerts, which was a large part of why she stopped after 1982. But when she started up again about 16 years later, she started telling the people she was working with how much more she was enjoying it, and she did a lot more concerts in her later years than she had during the 1970s and ‘80s. She may not have been having many hit records by that point, but she could still draw her large, loyal, and enthusiastic following to concerts.
kk: The first time I saw Olivia live, I took my daughter, who is, herself, also a lifetime fan. (Her very first book report in school was about Olivia Newton-John. Her second was on John Travolta! And she remains a major fan to this day, even having the strength to endure … I mean watch “Xanadu” 20-something times!!!)
At that show, Dennis Tufano, former lead singer of The Buckinghams (and a long-time friend of Forgotten Hits) was her male counterpart for the “Grease” and “Xanadu” numbers. I was so pleased by this in that it’s also Dennis who appeared in the commercially released video of those concerts.
But I never realized that fellow Chicagoan Skip Griparis (one of the final members of The New Colony Six) had played such a large role in Olivia’s touring years. His accounts of these moments are absolutely glowing and offer keen insight as to what it was like to be part of Team Olivia. In fact, it seems that EVERYONE ever connected with Livy’s touring band has only the nicest things to say about her and the way she treated them … sort of the Taylor Swift of her time!
MH: This might sound trite, too, but just about everyone I interviewed who toured with her, whether it was Skip Griparis from 1975 through ’78, Dennis Tufano in ’82, or Warren Ham from 2001 through 2017, said that touring with her was one of the greatest experiences of their entire careers. (And Ham has toured with lots of big acts … Toto … Ringo Starr.) And speaking of Taylor Swift, I think Olivia helped pave the way for her, too, especially in terms of country/pop crossover success.
kk: Everything we’ve talked about so far has been on a very positive note … so I have to come up with at least ONE negative thing to say about the book … and that was an easy one for me …
What the heck is up with that cover photograph?!?!?
MH: Honestly, I was just glad that the publisher sprang for a photo from Alamy or Getty. All the other books I’ve written, I’ve had to use something that was public domain, or, in the case of the Andy Gibb book, find one on my own that I could get the rights to use without paying too much. For the Olivia book, I picked a few photos, sent them to the publisher, and they designed the cover.
kk: A book about Olivia Newton-John should be bright and shiny and jumping off the bookshelf – glowing as she did! Silvery, sparkling … a real attention grabber. But in this photo, she just blends into the background … wearing virtually the same color dress as the background color … she disappears! If this goes into another printing, you REALLY should consider doing something to draw more attention to the positive energy that she conveyed throughout her career. I want to see Olivia in all her effervescent sunshine! I guarantee you it will draw much more attention to your book!
MH: I mean, I am a writer, what do I know about cover art or photos - haha. But I’ll pass along your thoughts to the publisher. A paperback is already in the planning, so maybe a new cover will be in order. (Also, more interestingly and importantly, to me at least: Two weeks after the book came out, John Farrar — who produced many of, and wrote some of, Olivia’s hits, and who I’d wanted to interview but couldn’t find — emailed me and said that Greg Mathieson was totally wrong in claiming to have come up with the “ooo, ooo, ooo” hook on “You’re the One that I Want,” and that Bill Oakes exaggerated how much direction he gave to Farrar before Farrar wrote that song and “Hopelessly Devoted to You.” So I’ll need to work that into the paperback somehow.)
kk: That’s great news about an “updated” paperback edition. (Maybe John Farrar can send you an “exclusive” photo to use!) Or, once her people hear how well the book is doing, they might “comp” you a glitzier photo that’ll help to sell more copies of the book! And then we can BOTH make a ton of money after you pay me my 10% marketing-strategy royalties!!! (lol)
MH: “Updated" is too strong a word, but I promised John Farrar that I would get his response into the paperback. There's nothing more to it though than what I said here. As for the cover photo, I think Olivia's fans are buying the book regardless -- the printed version of the book keeps selling out as fast as the publisher can stock it. But there's certainly no shortage of other photos of her, that's for sure. She had to be one of the most photographed persons of her era.
kk: Okay, I’ve given you enough of a hard time. I really did enjoy the book … and know others will, too. I understand the initial print run sold out and Amazon was actually out of stock on this item for a little while … but it’s back in stock now, right?
[EDITOR'S NOTE: “People Magazine” did a profile on Matt Hild’s book a few weeks back and copies started flying off the shelf – but I’m told that inventory has since been replenished and books are available now for immediate shipping. – kk]
https://people.com/olivia-newton-john-revealed-new-book-exclusive-11973344
MH: It’s a long story, but Amazon has had a harder time keeping it in stock than other booksellers have. Barnes and Noble has never run out online, and they’ve kept copies in some of their stores, too.
[Note: Amazon has received a shipment from the reprint, but they have yet to return the book to “in stock” status even as smaller outlets such as Books-A-Million and Bookshop restocked from that reprint and have already sold out for the third time. Amazon SHOULD have the book relisted as “in stock” sometime this week, but I mention Barnes and Noble as the reliable Plan B.]
Readers can order a copy from Amazon here:
… or from Barnes and Noble here:
https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/a-little-more-love-matthew-hild/1147995376?ean=9798216368021
kk: What’s next on the horizon for you? Have you got a new candidate selected for your next book?
MH: Right now, I am writing some academic history again, but this will probably be an article, not a book. As for another pop music book, I am thinking about it, but I want to give it some thought before I jump into another one. If you have any good suggestions, let me know!
kk: Matthew, thanks again for taking the time to talk with us today. I wish you much more success with your passion … and please keep us posted so we can let other music fans know what else you might have coming up!
MH: Thanks, Kent. I appreciate you featuring my book on Andy Gibb and this one in Forgotten Hits, which I was reading long before Scott Paton introduced us via email back in 2022. Forgotten Hits is a tremendous resource for “oldies” fans!
60 YEARS AGO TODAY:
6/28/66 – Actor John Cusack is born
